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post #1 of 23 (permalink) Old 11-09-2005, 12:51 PM Thread Starter
 
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Shoulder Pain!

For the past 4-5 months I've been battling pain in my right shoulder. No specific injury but the amount of weight I can do on some core exercises has gone down significantly. Things like Flat /Incline bench with the bar, dips and shoulder presses... I either can't do or have cut weight by a third.

It's deep inside. I can't put my finger on it. Feels tight & sharp. Not good! Rotator cuff...?

Dumbell raises to my side and front seem fine, as do flys etc...

Anyone else ever experienced this before? What do you think it is? I hate taking Motrin - I refuse to but damn sometimes it hurts...

I need to see a Doc & change my workouts... I'm backing myself into a smaller wardrobe
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post #2 of 23 (permalink) Old 11-09-2005, 01:16 PM
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go see a doc and i'm sure stone will say the same. also don't do anything to make it hurt. do high rep stuff if you can do that


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post #3 of 23 (permalink) Old 11-09-2005, 05:13 PM
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Sounds like you might have an impinged shoulder. I was having issues like that a while ago as well.

Check into a doctor or physical therapist and see what they have to say.

I wound up having to do a lot of rotator cuff exercises for months while cutting back on the weights and not doing any bench movements. When I was able to bench, I switched over to DB's for the free range movement and not being restricted by the barbell.
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post #4 of 23 (permalink) Old 11-09-2005, 08:47 PM
 
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WHere is it?? its it in front of the shoulder. Can you do rotator movements?

Bicipital tendonitis is SUPER common. If you have a rotator cuff injury yes you need to see a doctor unfortunatly. what kind of pain? was there ever a specific event where you felt a sharp pain? or is it a dull onset sort of pain?
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post #5 of 23 (permalink) Old 11-09-2005, 08:51 PM
 
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Can you do these movements? If you can we can help you. if not you need to see a doctor.




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post #6 of 23 (permalink) Old 11-09-2005, 08:55 PM
 
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If you can do dumbell presses ok. Im leaning away from a rotator cuff injury. Im willing to bet its bursitis of the bicipital tendon. WHile it is most easliy felt after doing chest/front delt exercises symptoms can manifest as nondiscript pain within the entire shoulder gurdle.

Let us know som emore info and we'll straighten you out.
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post #7 of 23 (permalink) Old 11-10-2005, 04:14 AM
 
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great info here guys.. ive been battling tendonitis in my shoulders for years. id certainly say you absolutely have to stay away from exercises that cause pain, your just doing more damage. do the exercises that dont hurt, and you need to start working on your rotator cuff strength like fjorn, and slc have stated. i havent done flat benching in over 10 years due to how it restricts movement and causes pain in my shoulders.. dumbells only for me (except an occasional heavy push here and there) im currently recovering from a bout of tendonitis in both shoulder and elbow. ive always been pretty stubborn about doing those exact shoulder exercises that slc has posted up in pictures, but from here on out im not going to slack off on those anymore.. if you experience pain doing those then it could be bigger trouble than tendonitis and you should certainly see an ortho..
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post #8 of 23 (permalink) Old 11-10-2005, 08:24 AM Thread Starter
 
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Well I can do all of the movements pictured in SLC's post without pain.

There wasn't any specific event that led up to it... but I'm almost 38 so my body doesn't recover or heal like it used to.

When I bench, the pain is at the bottom of the movement... almost along my rear delt and up across my right trap. But when I do dips, it seems to be deep inside... hard to pin down exactly where. I can't seem to press right on where it hurts.

That originally made me think Rotator Cuff - but I can do exercises comfortable that seem to eliminate that possibility...

Keep the info coming - this is pretyt helpful
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post #9 of 23 (permalink) Old 11-10-2005, 09:48 AM
 
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1 week off upper body.
ICE that puppy
After 3 days start stretching
For first 8 exercises on shoulders and Chest 800mg ibuprofen before you start and ice afterward.

WARM UPS ARE NOW YOUR BEST FRIEND. You should be warming up for about 10-15 mins before chest and shoulders and arms.

Im not a fan of hiding the pain. But ibuprofen really can be helpful in keeping the swelling response minimized when you workout a recovering body part and you will recover quicker.

I need to take some pics of SHoulder Dislocates for you.. These have helped me big time in my shoulder pain. It stretches the shoulders out getting blood to your poor beat up tendons. WHen I have someone over I'll take pictures of them they are hard to describe.
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post #10 of 23 (permalink) Old 11-10-2005, 12:45 PM Thread Starter
 
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Very cool! Yes - pics would help. Stretching def helps. Hard for me to get a good shoulder stretch... I haven't found the right movements.

Warm ups are another biggie for me. As I've aged, I've had a lot of nagging little tendon issues - probably from years of abuse in the gym and playing various sports. Luckily I'm still way ahead of the curve, but this time around it's been harder to beat.
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post #11 of 23 (permalink) Old 11-10-2005, 03:07 PM
 
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I'll get pictures tonight but here is a discription.

Take a towel spin it up so its a thick cord.

Grab it one end in each hand. It will act as a tether between your two hands.

Now hold onto the towel and pulling it taught with arms straight bring them straight overhead then back behind you. So now the towel is in each hand but behind your back..

Now inch your hands in a little closer to each other and do it again. once you find a distance that you can BARELY get it from front to back do it 50 times. readjusting as needed to keep the shoulders stretching.

THis has done WONDERS for my bursitis in my shoulders. As a big dumb bodybuilder that constantly pounds high volume workouts my shoulders are never perfect and they hurt but when they start getting bad its almost ALWAYS becuas I've been lazy with thsi stretch.
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post #12 of 23 (permalink) Old 11-10-2005, 03:09 PM
 
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Also after the soreness has subsided a few days after a workout ben-gay may be beneficial by increasing the blood flow around the shoulders.
... just deal with the smelling bad part.
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post #13 of 23 (permalink) Old 11-10-2005, 03:23 PM Thread Starter
 
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LOL - I smell bad anyway :1poke j/k

Well just downed my 800mg Ibuprofen and I will do the towel stretch for starters. No chest workout today. Just Back & Cardio so...
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post #14 of 23 (permalink) Old 11-10-2005, 06:44 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AZScorpion
But when I do dips, it seems to be deep inside... hard to pin down exactly where. I can't seem to press right on where it hurts.

Describe the dips you're doing. Is it at a dipping station, and are you going down with the body verticle, or leaning forward. Or, is it that you're doing dips on a bench?


I think what it could be is that you'e running into an issue where you're going to deep on your dips. lMO, you should never go parallel, or below parallel. You really put your body into a funky position, and it's one of the hardest to get out of when at the bottom.
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post #15 of 23 (permalink) Old 11-10-2005, 08:11 PM
 
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Me, I dont care if it hurts!!!!! Use it until it breaks!


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post #16 of 23 (permalink) Old 11-11-2005, 07:31 AM Thread Starter
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fjorn
Quote:
Originally Posted by AZScorpion
But when I do dips, it seems to be deep inside... hard to pin down exactly where. I can't seem to press right on where it hurts.

Describe the dips you're doing. Is it at a dipping station, and are you going down with the body verticle, or leaning forward. Or, is it that you're doing dips on a bench?


I think what it could be is that you'e running into an issue where you're going to deep on your dips. lMO, you should never go parallel, or below parallel. You really put your body into a funky position, and it's one of the hardest to get out of when at the bottom.
Yeah - I do them at a dip station usually with the narrower grip... elbows in - not splayed out and I lean forward. I go down to the point where I get a good stretch... probably a few inches from middle of my chest coming even with my hands. Maybe 4-6 inches.

It pretty much hurts from the moment I start the movement down...

SLC - I did those stretches with a towel last night & man! My shoulders feel way looser. That's a great stretch! I've always been tight in my shoulders. That's a great movement.
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post #17 of 23 (permalink) Old 11-11-2005, 07:43 AM
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Okay. doesn't sound like you're going down too far and shouldn't cause issues.


The stretching Stone mentioned is great! I was shown that a couple of months ago when I was learning proper technique on the Olympic lifts. Only, we use a broomstick handle or closet rod, because we'd go right into overhead squats with the pole to stretch out down below.

Another thing I learned at the same time is to stretch out my triceps and lats. "Big dumb lifters" rarely do Olympic lifts, and therefore rarely know about stretching these out while holding a loaded bar in a clean position.

Between these three, I've limbered up some, but am no where near what I was like when I was doing Tae kwon Do on a regular basis.

Before I forget... Stangman, that's a great way to set yourself back even further.
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post #18 of 23 (permalink) Old 11-11-2005, 10:30 AM
 
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Fjorn,
I was shown it with a broomstick as well but I cant do it nearly as well with a rod of any type a towel gives you a little wiggle room and doesn't hurt my wrists.

As with dips or any lift... I have to disagree here guys.. I go as far down as possible to stretch the shoulder and tricep. If you have properly functioning joints/tendons going to full stretch shouldn't injur the body. It does put the shoulder and elbow into angles that leave them more susceptible to injury HOWEVER do not take this as a bad thing.. It only means that it can be dangerous IF you jump up in weight too fast. I dip with either 8 plates on the hammer dip machine or 2 plates hanging all the way to full stretch and I even hold the stretch at the end of each set... and my shoulders are fine.
I think this is the same with squatting people said for years squatting below parallel was dangerous for your knees. I think its dangerous if youre using a weight they aren't ready for. I have never had a problem with my knees *knocking on wood* and I squat ass to the grass every single solitary time. And I've gotten just over 600lbs on 2 occasions and every other week squat with 5XXlbs. Always as low as the body can go while keeping the back straight and heels on the ground.

I think working through full range of movement is beneficial in that it equally stresses the joint/connective tissue through their full range. STopping prematurely adds a tension spike as you stop the weight. If you ease into a full range applying an easy stretch on the joint then transitioning into the concentric, lifting, phase you work (or damage) equally all the connecting points intsead of wearing away at the stronger points.

Yes your joints are stronger and at more of an advantage at certain angles but that doesn't mean you should only work them in that advantageous range.
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post #19 of 23 (permalink) Old 11-11-2005, 03:33 PM
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Stone, I hold the broomstick handle fairly loose and only with the thumb and index finger typically. This allows both arms to move at the same time, and get a decent stretch simultaneously without one or the other moving first.

Overall, I'll agree that full range of motion exercises are best. But, I've seen more people injur themselves doing dips going well below parallel. It could be like you said that they aren't ready for the weight. I haven't done dips in the past couple of years, so I can't say much to them beyond that.
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post #20 of 23 (permalink) Old 11-12-2005, 09:12 AM
 
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Fjorn,
I think most likely you're right and I think dips are probalby the 2nd most likely place (2nd only to flat bench) to tear something. I dont do flat bench becuase I think its just an ego move and it can easily be replaced. I do however do hanging dips. Although lately I have just been doing bodyweight dips towards the end of my workout and doing them slow and controlled im lucky to get 10.

So anyone doing dips should be very careful and make sure you know what you're doing.
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