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post #1 of 42 (permalink) Old 08-30-2006, 04:46 PM Thread Starter
 
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Do racecars have slipper clutches?

Never thought about this until a couple weeks ago we were watching a car race in between ours and a few of the cars were downshifting coming into turn 1 and it really sounded like they had a slipper clutch. some would come in and pop chirp the tires from engine breaking but some would almost just coast in.

Just curious.
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post #2 of 42 (permalink) Old 08-30-2006, 04:54 PM
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Quote:
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Never thought about this until a couple weeks ago we were watching a car race in between ours and a few of the cars were downshifting coming into turn 1 and it really sounded like they had a slipper clutch. some would come in and pop chirp the tires from engine breaking but some would almost just coast in.

Just curious.
What type of race car are you referring to?

I have never heard of a race car having them but I know many automatic trans. race cars have what's called Stall converters.... which disengage the clutch (if you will) until a certain high RPM.. This pretty much works the same way a slipper clutch works.

Most race cars that I have been around actually use the engine braking to help them slow down.... unlike a bike, where you don't want the rear wheel to slide out under engine braking, they actually need it.


Just my .02 lol



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post #3 of 42 (permalink) Old 08-30-2006, 04:59 PM Thread Starter
 
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here is one. dont know what to call these. there were camaros, corvettes and mustangs most of them were tubular frames and just a race body.
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post #4 of 42 (permalink) Old 08-30-2006, 05:51 PM
 
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For cars, they use something called "LSD" (limited slip differential)...


Most passenger cars doesn't come with one though, it's a popular performance upgrade for track and drag use...


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Limited_slip_differential


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post #5 of 42 (permalink) Old 08-30-2006, 06:40 PM
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Originally Posted by valerossi View Post
For cars, they use something called "LSD" (limited slip differential)...


Most passenger cars doesn't come with one though, it's a popular performance upgrade for track and drag use...


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Limited_slip_differential


There's also (limited slip differential) LSD's for front diff's and center diff's if your AWD (all wheel drive) :
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post #6 of 42 (permalink) Old 08-30-2006, 08:43 PM Thread Starter
 
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but aren't LSDs just limiting the slippage on the outside wheel so when you launch both are spinning? I didn' tknow they controlled back torque.
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post #7 of 42 (permalink) Old 08-30-2006, 09:03 PM
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but aren't LSDs just limiting the slippage on the outside wheel so when you launch both are spinning? I didn' tknow they controlled back torque.
Yes all they do is limit the lock up between the two wheels....

It's not very comparative to a slipper clutch at all.



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post #8 of 42 (permalink) Old 08-30-2006, 09:14 PM
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Quote:
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Yes all they do is limit the lock up between the two wheels....

It's not very comparative to a slipper clutch at all.
:imwst

I was just stating that cuz val stated it
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post #9 of 42 (permalink) Old 08-30-2006, 09:19 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by STONE View Post
Never thought about this until a couple weeks ago we were watching a car race in between ours and a few of the cars were downshifting coming into turn 1 and it really sounded like they had a slipper clutch. some would come in and pop chirp the tires from engine breaking but some would almost just coast in.

Just curious.
I think that'd be more technique than mechanical, prob heel toe method to match gear rpm's with eng rpm.
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post #10 of 42 (permalink) Old 08-30-2006, 09:22 PM
 
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Did you guys actually read the link I posted?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Limited_slip_differential

There are 2 types of LSD for cars... one of them is called the "clutch type"... it's not "exactly" the same as a slipper clutch... well, you get my point...

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post #11 of 42 (permalink) Old 08-30-2006, 09:29 PM
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Did you guys actually read the link I posted?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Limited_slip_differential

There are 2 types of LSD... the "mechanical type" is also known as the "clutch type"...


I don't have to read it Vale, I have installed a few of them myself, when I was younger and still in school, I used to work at a shop that built custom race cars and street rods....

A limited slip differental has nothing to do with a slipper clutch in a bike.... It's for a different purpose all together.

You are correct though, there are a couple of different types of limited slip differentals..... one is a clutch type but it only releases the lock up under extreme conditions between the two wheels on the same axle. There are a couple of other types as well.... one of the mot popular around here is called "Auburn Gear" They have there own "type of slipping system"

anyway..... : :1poke



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post #12 of 42 (permalink) Old 08-30-2006, 09:32 PM
 
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Btw... I edited my post...


The idea is the same thing... which it's to prevent wheel lockup...


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post #13 of 42 (permalink) Old 08-30-2006, 09:35 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by valerossi View Post
Btw... I edited my post...


The idea is the same thing... which it's to prevent wheel lockup...



Yes that it correct, but............... it to prevent the "lockup of the two wheels on one axle" not the lock up of the tire to the ground.


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post #14 of 42 (permalink) Old 08-30-2006, 09:41 PM
 
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Well... if you think about it, two wheels don't lockup in cars will prevent the wheels from spinning, this is why you see drag cars use LSD also... and bikes only have a single wheel at the back...



:1poke
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post #15 of 42 (permalink) Old 08-30-2006, 09:44 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by STONE View Post
but aren't LSDs just limiting the slippage on the outside wheel so when you launch both are spinning? I didn' tknow they controlled back torque.
I haven't heard of slippers being used in this aspect, maybe it was a sequential gearbox. Not that it may not occur, I've just never heard of it.

In Australia, we have a 1,000 kilometer race called at the moment SUPERCHEAPAUTO1000 at Mt Panorama in Bathurst, NSW. It wasn't a slipper clutch as such, but cars got banned from using lock-up clutches (generally used in dragracing, I had them in my dragbikes) to get a good launch and get the horsepower to the ground (and they use counter weights which lock up using rear wheel / drive train rpm).

Slider clutches which are used in fuel bikes/ race cars and some of the smaller classes, which are based on engine rpm and counterweights to lock up.


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post #16 of 42 (permalink) Old 08-30-2006, 09:45 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by valerossi View Post
Well... if you think about it, two wheels don't lockup in cars will prevent the wheels from spinning, this is why you see drag cars use LSD also... and bikes only have a single wheel at the back...



:1poke

Actually almost all drag cars are locked up rear ends.... lol

The only reason for the slipping the axle is when they are turning and one wheel is rotating more than the other.... When the wheels are locked up, it will then wear out the gears or break the axle.

The only reason for a limited slip axle is so you don't break the axle or differental when turning...

:1poke.. you keep asking... so I keep telling.... :1poke



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post #17 of 42 (permalink) Old 08-30-2006, 09:46 PM
 
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Also, not sure if you guys remember those first articles about slipper clutch finally comes on a street bikes when Kawi released that on the ZX-10R? A few of those editors has written things like "having a slipper clutch IS LIKE having a LSD"...


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post #18 of 42 (permalink) Old 08-30-2006, 09:49 PM
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I might also add I'm running a limited slip differental in my Avalanche.... lol it's an "auburn gear" unit that I referred to above.


and believe me there is no reduction in engine braking...



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post #19 of 42 (permalink) Old 08-30-2006, 09:56 PM
 
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Actually almost all drag cars are locked up rear ends.... lol

The only reason for the slipping the axle is when they are turning and one wheel is rotating more than the other.... When the wheels are locked up, it will then wear out the gears or break the axle.

The only reason for a limited slip axle is so you don't break the axle or differental when turning...

:1poke.. you keep asking... so I keep telling.... :1poke
Turst me, I know how a LSD works...

For sure you still see lockups in drag cars even with LSD, cause it's based on the torque ratio of the LSD... there are adjustable LSDs and you can adjust it to a point that it doesn't act like LSD anymore...

And bikes only has one wheel at the back... so no point of using a LSD...

I'm not saying they're the "exact" same component, but the principal is the same, it's to get more usable power to the ground and more controllable...


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post #20 of 42 (permalink) Old 08-30-2006, 10:00 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by valerossi View Post
Well... if you think about it, two wheels don't lockup in cars will prevent the wheels from spinning, this is why you see drag cars use LSD also... and bikes only have a single wheel at the back...



:1poke
A lot of the bigger horsepower race cars have gone away from LSD and to a locked (Full & Mini Spools eg: http://www.chrismans.com/SlipDiff.html) diffierential setup with a slider/mulit stage lock-up clutch. May not be as much fun to try and turn, but in dragracing you're only going straight most of the time, well you hope you are :jimmie . LSD's for that matter can also be horsepower robbing.


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Last edited by Warp Racer; 08-30-2006 at 10:07 PM.
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