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post #1 of 28 (permalink) Old 04-30-2007, 01:08 PM Thread Starter
 
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The real truth about CFL

For those that live in California, where they want to ban incandescent light bulbs in favor of Compact Fluorescent Lights....
You might be interested in this story.....

-------------------------------------------------
How much money does it take to screw in a compact fluorescent light bulb? About US$4.28 for the bulb and labour -- unless you break the bulb. Then you, like Brandy Bridges of Ellsworth, Maine, could be looking at a cost of about US$2,004.28, which doesn't include the costs of frayed nerves and risks to health.

Sound crazy? Perhaps no more than the stampede to ban the incandescent light bulb in favour of compact fluorescent light bulbs (CFLs).

According to an April 12 article in The Ellsworth American, Bridges had the misfortune of breaking a CFL during installation in her daughter's bedroom: It dropped and shattered on the carpeted floor.

Aware that CFLs contain potentially hazardous substances, Bridges called her local Home Depot for advice. The store told her that the CFL contained mercury and that she should call the Poison Control hotline, which in turn directed her to the Maine Department of Environmental Protection.

The DEP sent a specialist to Bridges' house to test for mercury contamination. The specialist found mercury levels in the bedroom in excess of six times the state's "safe" level for mercury contamination of 300 billionths of a gram per cubic meter. The DEP specialist recommended that Bridges call an environmental cleanup firm, which reportedly gave her a "low-ball" estimate of US$2,000 to clean up the room. The room then was sealed off with plastic and Bridges began "gathering finances" to pay for the US$2,000 cleaning. Reportedly, her insurance company wouldn't cover the cleanup costs because mercury is a pollutant.

Given that the replacement of incandescent bulbs with CFLs in the average U.S. household is touted as saving as much as US$180 annually in energy costs -- and assuming that Bridges doesn't break any more CFLs -- it will take her more than 11 years to recoup the cleanup costs in the form of energy savings.

The potentially hazardous CFL is being pushed by companies such as Wal-Mart, which wants to sell 100 million CFLs at five times the cost of incandescent bulbs during 2007, and, surprisingly, environmentalists.

It's quite odd that environmentalists have embraced the CFL, which cannot now and will not in the foreseeable future be made without mercury. Given that there are about five billion light bulb sockets in North American households, we're looking at the possibility of creating billions of hazardous waste sites such as the Bridges' bedroom.

Usually, environmentalists want hazardous materials out of, not in, our homes. These are the same people who go berserk at the thought of mercury being emitted from power plants and the presence of mercury in seafood. Environmentalists have whipped up so much fear of mercury among the public that many local governments have even launched mercury thermometer exchange programs.

As the activist group Environmental Defense urges us to buy CFLs, it defines mercury on a separate part of its Web site as a "highly toxic heavy metal that can cause brain damage and learning disabilities in fetuses and children" and as "one of the most poisonous forms of pollution."

Greenpeace also recommends CFLs while simultaneously bemoaning contamination caused by a mercury-thermometer factory in India. But where are mercury-containing CFLs made? Not in the United States, under strict environmental regulation. CFLs are made in India and China, where environmental standards are virtually non-existent.

And let's not forget about the regulatory nightmare in the U.S. known as the Superfund law, the EPA regulatory program best known for requiring expensive but often needless cleanup of toxic waste sites, along with endless litigation over such cleanups.

We'll eventually be disposing billions and billions of CFL mercury bombs. Much of the mercury from discarded and/or broken CFLs is bound to make its way into the environment and give rise to Superfund liability, which in the past has needlessly disrupted many lives, cost tens of billions of dollars and sent many businesses into bankruptcy.

As each CFL contains five milligrams of mercury, at the Maine "safety" standard of 300 nanograms per cubic meter, it would take 16,667 cubic meters of soil to "safely" contain all the mercury in a single CFL. While CFL vendors and environmentalists tout the energy cost savings of CFLs, they conveniently omit the personal and societal costs of CFL disposal.

Not only are CFLs much more expensive than incandescent bulbs and emit light that many regard as inferior to incandescent bulbs, they pose a nightmare if they break and require special disposal procedures. Yet governments (egged on by environmentalists and the Wal-Marts of the world) are imposing on us such higher costs, denial of lighting choice, disposal hassles and breakage risks in the name of saving a few dollars every year on the electric bill?

- Steven Milloy publishes JunkScience.com and CSRWatch.com. He is a junk-science expert and advocate of free enterprise, and an adjunct scholar at the Competitive Enterprise Institute.
------------------------------


Now I'm not saying that the person referenced here didn't go overboard, but you gotta wonder, if mercury is SO bad, that we shouldn't have thermometer's that use it in our houses, then why do people think that having a mercury vapor powered fluorescent light is "ok".

There are several examples of mercury vapor from Flo lights leeching into soils and causing environmental issues over the years.
And now we want to just add billions of them into the system by just banning the alternative because it uses a little more energy....

and people wonder why most politicians are considered moronic and shortsighted.
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post #2 of 28 (permalink) Old 04-30-2007, 01:24 PM
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I'm wondering, *especially* after reading this, why there isn't a push for LED lighting -- I don't believe it runs the environmental risks of CFLs and it's definitely more energy-efficient than an incandescent.

On a personal level, I really don't like the harshness of the light produced by CFL bulbs. I spend enough time during the day under flourescent lighting -- last thing I want is to go home and sit under more of it.
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post #3 of 28 (permalink) Old 04-30-2007, 02:33 PM
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What a bunch of retards. Fuck over-zealous, close-minded, "environmentalists".
post #4 of 28 (permalink) Old 04-30-2007, 04:44 PM
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I forwarded that to my father. He recently replaced all the bulbs in his house..

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post #5 of 28 (permalink) Old 04-30-2007, 04:50 PM Thread Starter
 
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I forwarded that to my father. He recently replaced all the bulbs in his house..
tell him we said thanks for ruining the environment.....
following the advice of stupid environmentalists...

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post #6 of 28 (permalink) Old 04-30-2007, 04:53 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by shagzomatic View Post
I'm wondering, *especially* after reading this, why there isn't a push for LED lighting -- I don't believe it runs the environmental risks of CFLs and it's definitely more energy-efficient than an incandescent.

On a personal level, I really don't like the harshness of the light produced by CFL bulbs. I spend enough time during the day under flourescent lighting -- last thing I want is to go home and sit under more of it.
I just installed an outdoor light set at my house that is LED lighting... they say it's about 5 bucks a year for the whole set 10 lights total. I was very impressed with the light output as well.



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post #7 of 28 (permalink) Old 04-30-2007, 04:54 PM
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On this topic, with the high energy costs here in cali, they do make a difference in the pg&e bill for sure though.

I changed all mine out a few years ago and it helped more then I thought it would.



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post #8 of 28 (permalink) Old 04-30-2007, 04:56 PM Thread Starter
 
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On this topic, with the high energy costs here in cali, they do make a difference in the pg&e bill for sure though.

I changed all mine out a few years ago and it helped more then I thought it would.
so wpuld not requiring the energy plants to jump through hoops and pay billions in legal fee's to offset the idotic court cases against them......
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post #9 of 28 (permalink) Old 04-30-2007, 05:01 PM
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post #10 of 28 (permalink) Old 04-30-2007, 05:03 PM
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so wpuld not requiring the energy plants to jump through hoops and pay billions in legal fee's to offset the idotic court cases against them......
Or the fooking gas companies making multi billion dollar profits when we are paying them twice what the gas is worth... both natural and regular gas. bastids



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post #11 of 28 (permalink) Old 04-30-2007, 05:22 PM Thread Starter
 
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Or the fooking gas companies making multi billion dollar profits when we are paying them twice what the gas is worth... both natural and regular gas. bastids
gas prices are NOT SET BY THE GAS COMPANIES.

gasoline, diesel, natural gas, propane, and all other distillates are sold on the commodity market, the same as orange juice, coirn, wheat and many other things.

so blaming the oil companies is akin to blaming the road for the death of the idiot in the car accident.
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post #12 of 28 (permalink) Old 04-30-2007, 06:31 PM
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OPEC is the modern day mafia w/o the guns well kinda if you exclude the Iraq war


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post #13 of 28 (permalink) Old 04-30-2007, 07:26 PM
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OPEC is the modern day mafia w/o the guns well kinda if you exclude the Iraq war

Don't start with OPEC, all because they aren't buddies with the rest of the oil producers on the planet. Now if they were to drop their prices the rest of the worlds oil producers would be in a right pickle.


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post #14 of 28 (permalink) Old 05-01-2007, 05:31 PM
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CFL = Choppers For Life!
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post #15 of 28 (permalink) Old 05-01-2007, 05:44 PM
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I use them in my house but i never really thought about the mercury in them. after taking a consumer chemistry class though i can state that mercury is damn bad. might not be worth it if enough of these break and i'm sure they will.


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post #16 of 28 (permalink) Old 05-01-2007, 06:22 PM
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I'm pretty sure they almost all will break. Even if you throw it away in you own trash can and it doesn't break it will some where down the line..Like the Garbage truck, the transfer station, the truck hauling it to the land fill, the dozer pushing it around in the land fill..... it's gonna break somewhere...

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post #17 of 28 (permalink) Old 05-01-2007, 09:49 PM Thread Starter
 
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I'm pretty sure they almost all will break. Even if you throw it away in you own trash can and it doesn't break it will some where down the line..Like the Garbage truck, the transfer station, the truck hauling it to the land fill, the dozer pushing it around in the land fill..... it's gonna break somewhere...
exactly, and since they usually get buried in the landfill, now that wonderful mercury can leech into the surrounding ground or into the ground water....

yummy.
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post #18 of 28 (permalink) Old 05-01-2007, 10:16 PM
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Quote:
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I'm pretty sure they almost all will break. Even if you throw it away in you own trash can and it doesn't break it will some where down the line..Like the Garbage truck, the transfer station, the truck hauling it to the land fill, the dozer pushing it around in the land fill..... it's gonna break somewhere...
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exactly, and since they usually get buried in the landfill, now that wonderful mercury can leech into the surrounding ground or into the ground water....

yummy.
Tough part is educating the end user, shippers and waste contractors to handle enviromentally hazardous items in a proficient manner. The EPA has a tough job on enforcing protective measures on hazardous materials.


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post #19 of 28 (permalink) Old 05-02-2007, 06:41 AM Thread Starter
 
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Tough part is educating the end user, shippers and waste contractors to handle enviromentally hazardous items in a proficient manner. The EPA has a tough job on enforcing protective measures on hazardous materials.
the part that i find idiotic is that the politicians (who we all know are basically morons, especially a certain group of them in california) wants to legislate that this is the only choice, thus causing the very problems that most sane people want to avoid.

if you had a choice between spending less on a product, that at worst, causes a little more CO2 into the atmosphere, or more on a product that can actually cause not only death, but a nice painful and very ugly one, to not only you but MILLIONS of people simply by being disposed of in the normal way most people dispose of their trash, which would you prefer?

me personally, knowing what i know about methane emmissions versus CO2 emmissions, and how they both really affect the "greenhouse effect" and that underground disposal of mercury nitrate (which was used in the electronics industry for many many years) actually does cause serious iussues (enough to keep a building in the town i live in empty and unsellable for nearly 60 years) and even now the previous corporation that owned it is still liable for any contamination caused by the ground around the building, i'll take the regular incandescent bilb and deal with the slightly higher cost of running it, since i rarely run lights in my house anyway.
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post #20 of 28 (permalink) Old 05-02-2007, 08:29 AM
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double standards.......
fuck all that, I just buy "light bulbs" off the shelf, I could give a shit who makes them, and mine are at least 100 watts or more. My house, my lights, I'll pay the bill so to all the conservationists: Kiss my ass!

ps: nobody on here better rant about emissions, considering the first thing everyone does to their bike is pull of the LEGAL muffler and install a race muffler....lmao


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