Racing MotoGP, WSBK, BSB, AMA, F1, WRC, DTM, NASCAR, etc...

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post #1 of 57 (permalink) Old 09-30-2008, 06:41 PM Thread Starter
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Arrow 450 Motos

Anyone seen these things? Farkin' Sick! I looked to see if anyone has posted on them before but 450 motos is too short of a term to search.

450 Moto

Saw one out at Laguna Seca and that's how I heard about it:

DSC00916.JPG

They make a Suzuki, Yamaha, Honda, and Kawi and that's all I am aware of. What do you guys think? WERA is forming/has formed a class to race these and I think it would be very good for many people of all ages to get into what could be very competitive racing. I honestly am researching it myself and looking into what it would take to get going. They are relatively cheap and would be fairly low maintenance bikes. Opinions?
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post #2 of 57 (permalink) Old 09-30-2008, 06:45 PM
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the "relativly cheap" and "fairly low maintenance" are the 2 parts of this deal that I"m gonna say need to be contested. Relativly cheap until you start needing spares and replacement parts. Sure it only costs 10,000 to buy, and a TZ250 costs 20, but the TZ can go 5 years without buying a single part for it.

"low maintenance"? I think not, there's a reason that club level MXers are going back the the 250's and 125's.

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post #3 of 57 (permalink) Old 09-30-2008, 06:50 PM Thread Starter
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well I don't keep up with MX so i wouldn't know, I've never ridden a dirtbike. I was just under the impression it would be cheap considering parts would be cheap as they would be readily available seeing as we carry all the bikes and parts here as opposed to the imported 250s some people race in the states.
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post #4 of 57 (permalink) Old 09-30-2008, 07:06 PM
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fair point, the parts are available. Like i say tho, a 250 comes with enough parts for several seasons, right from the get-go.

If I was gonna build a racer like this tho it'd be a 250 2-stroke motocross engine, to be honest. just on the grounds of raceability and reliability. I'm sure that'll not come as a shock to people tho.

And dude, if you've not ridden a dirtbike you seriously should. Throw a leg over a 250/450, it'll blow you're fucking mind how fast those little bastards are.

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post #5 of 57 (permalink) Old 09-30-2008, 07:12 PM Thread Starter
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Yeah that's the point I was looking at it from. I have been reading a lot lately about the TZs and although I would much rather own one of those than anything else, the initial investment is too much right now. I'm sure it would be a far superior bike in all aspects but I think these bikes will appeal more to the US crowd just on the basis of parts/convenience. Either way I am just happy it appears as if we "could" see more and more smaller cc bikes running around. The red bull rookies cup is really drawing a lot of attention back into it, I think it's awesome.

Yeah I've always wanted to see how the dirt world is, I've never even known anybody that owns one. maybe one day i'll get out there and see what it's all about
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post #6 of 57 (permalink) Old 09-30-2008, 07:22 PM
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man you live in the desert, no better place for it.

ya GP bikes in the US is a dieing breed, would sure be sweet to have 'em back tho. USGPRU was even talking of having an open prototype class. Be cool to see the nitroused TZ's run against the shortened busa's and Y2K's.

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post #7 of 57 (permalink) Old 09-30-2008, 07:27 PM Thread Starter
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I just would like to get into racing on a smaller bike is my main goal. I know I could pick up a 600 and go at it and possibly do well locally. But most of the great racers developed on 125-250cc bikes. (Rossi, Stoner, Pedrosa, Mladin, Spies) to name a few of the recent greats, and an up and comer (Josh Herrin). I figure there must be some sort of pattern here. I want to try to get in before I'm too old. If I come upon a large sum of money in the near future a TZ will be purchased, but until then I have to look for the cheaper routes. I could probably find a 450 and build it for under 10k easy I would imagine.
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post #8 of 57 (permalink) Old 09-30-2008, 07:36 PM
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there's used TZ's available cheap. It's not so much the lower displacement that teaches them as it is the GP chassis in my opinion. I mean you could learn on a 990 and it would be ok I think. Just a matter of learning to get a bike set-up is what make the difference.

I do think it's good that we're getting that tho, like you say any cup where you're running these things is good, Rowly Sands is helping out the sport by offering to run this cup.

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post #9 of 57 (permalink) Old 09-30-2008, 08:53 PM
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Back on topic... for PCP, if the factories were producing those bikes it would be great, but there not..... that being said it would be tough for a lot of reasons to own one I think.

I saw race your g/f's 250 ninja... you would be surprised on how much better you would be on your 1k after racing a 250 for a year or two



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post #10 of 57 (permalink) Old 09-30-2008, 08:59 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
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Back on topic... for PCP, if the factories were producing those bikes it would be great, but there not..... that being said it would be tough for a lot of reasons to own one I think.

I saw race your g/f's 250 ninja... you would be surprised on how much better you would be on your 1k after racing a 250 for a year or two
well the factories are producing the bikes, you just change a few things to make them road ready.

Yeah I want to start on a smaller bike for sure. I can track the 1K but I already know I will be way better off racing something else to start on. And yeah the ninja 250 might be alright if they come out with some parts for it.
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post #11 of 57 (permalink) Old 09-30-2008, 09:01 PM
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Show me where? cause this is a first if they are? I have not seen them anywhere as a factory bike?

Also you won't be able to register them here in cali anyways if there not DOT approved from the factory... I'm sure it's similar in other states but not sure.



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post #12 of 57 (permalink) Old 09-30-2008, 09:04 PM
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From my understanding these all start out as 450cc motocross bikes and then are converted by the owners to track bikes no?



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post #13 of 57 (permalink) Old 09-30-2008, 09:09 PM
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Rowland Sands will sell you a turnkey for ~$15k, which isn't a hell of a lot cheaper than a decent 250, and I think is actually more than a 125.

I don't see why you couldn't convert a WR tho, if you where really into it.

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post #14 of 57 (permalink) Old 09-30-2008, 09:15 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by R1Lover View Post
Show me where? cause this is a first if they are? I have not seen them anywhere as a factory bike?

Also you won't be able to register them here in cali anyways if there not DOT approved from the factory... I'm sure it's similar in other states but not sure.
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From my understanding these all start out as 450cc motocross bikes and then are converted by the owners to track bikes no?
yeah they are 450 motocross bikes, you can convert them or buy them completed if you follow that link I posted. It's not a factory effort as of yet. Do you have to register a track bike? They were running them at Laguna Seca

it's the same as converting a bike into a supermoto bike, so I don't see how this could be a bad/risky thing in any way.

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post #15 of 57 (permalink) Old 09-30-2008, 09:55 PM
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I see now, I thought you were saying the factory was putting these out as factory bikes lol

Now I see Roland has found a little nitch in the market and is rolling with it... That's what business is all about.



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post #16 of 57 (permalink) Old 09-30-2008, 09:58 PM Thread Starter
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I see now, I thought you were saying the factory was putting these out as factory bikes lol

Now I see Roland has found a little nitch in the market and is rolling with it... That's what business is all about.
Yeah, they aren't doing any major changes to them, forks, shock, rearsets, bars, plastics, wheels/tires. Just a simple conversion. I think they would be fun. Schwantz said he loves them and wishes he would have been able to ride them more
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post #17 of 57 (permalink) Old 09-30-2008, 10:34 PM
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Yeah, they aren't doing any major changes to them, forks, shock, rearsets, bars, plastics, wheels/tires. Just a simple conversion. I think they would be fun. Schwantz said he loves them and wishes he would have been able to ride them more
He's also said that a 250gp bike is a lot more economical option.

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post #18 of 57 (permalink) Old 09-30-2008, 10:40 PM
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Now I see Roland has found a little nitch in the market and is rolling with it... That's what business is all about.
Never underestimate the financial power of the singles crowd. They could afford Matchless', G50's and they can sure as shit afford this.

Mind you once upon a time they looked at Harley's as being far too high tech and brimming with fad tech that wouldn't last.... like disk brakes and oil coolers.

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post #19 of 57 (permalink) Old 09-30-2008, 10:45 PM
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Didn't know I did lol



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post #20 of 57 (permalink) Old 09-30-2008, 10:47 PM
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p.s. I had to google that as well

that was 50 years ago hehe



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